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EMF Meters
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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting that you are using direct current to measure EMF in an environment?
Direct current is the movement of electrical energy from A to B and Electromagnetic flow is the emination of magnetic energy produced by that flow. Plus interesting that you're using that method to show EMF preasant by lighting a light bulb. It would surely be easier to show EMF by producing a device which uses a magnet and coil connected to a speaker. The background EMF polution noise is well documented as the white noise in a environment which is such a pain for audio/anomalous research. (This is why we work with the electric turned off and lights out), (apart from the brain frequency thing and the ability to see light anomalies in the dark better and it doesn't over expose I.R cameras). EMF is audable polution, but is also a theoretical medium for spririt energys to embed E.V.P by utilising the E.M.F as an input frequency directed into the magnet or coil of the microphone to produce audable information. = Electronic Voice Phenomena. I'm by no means attempting to tell you how to run your workshops, but I find to prove EMF by showing its interaction audably, it makes it easier to explain E.V.P later. Good subject matter, thanks for the input.
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KiloCharlie



Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 47

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not showing anyone anything about EVP. I am showing the relationship between wavelength, polarisation & field strength. I am showing an electromagnetic field.
All electronic items should meet Electromagnetic Comparability standards, to both stop them causing unnecessary interference, but also to stop them being subject to it. Sadly this now means someone saying, not proving, that it does. The result is that far too many electronic items both cause & are subject of problems that are the direct result of electromagnetic fields.
The issue of electromagnetic compatibility, or more importantly incomparability is paramount when presenting any form of EVP. As implanting voices/noises on a remote electrical recorder, in a sealed room is all to simple to achieve, unless precautions are taken.
A good example of a unwanted case of a EMF, is TV antenna pre amplifiers, that have interfered with both Air & Marine emergency frequencies in both Europe & the USA. Also power line transformers have caused spot frequencies to emanate miles away within the houses fed by it. Switching off the electricity is not always sufficient, as the wiring will radiate the problem, unless isolated from the source...That is the outside source of power.
Also don't forget that many houses today have PME (Protective Multiple Earthing) so a whole row of houses share one earth system & if one of those houses has anything that uses Power Line Transmission (PLT.) Then simply throwing the mains switch will not stop that from entering your house. It needs isolating.
I am not saying that EVP does not exist or that EVP is often, sometimes or even ever caused by EMC issues. And I am not saying it is always or even often caused by someone deliberately running something like a transmitter that accidentally overloads the system used for recording. But what I am saying is that unless it is considered, protected against & discounted by the use of logical & provable steps being taken, how can a recording be seen as anything but potentially man made? And how do you prove after the event that a claim of it could be XY or Z is not the case?
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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 6:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you say is very true and it is nice to converse with someone who understands the complexities of the situation. It is true to say that controlling EMF polution is important and yes many E.v.p's have been documented and have been accountable to external interaction from outside sources. This is always going to be a problem for researchers. We can only attempt to remove as many form's of polution as possible without removing the ability for interactive and none interactive anomalous instances to occure. If we remove all the E.M.F from an environment we are theoretically removing the medium for any activity. It is believed that energies use electromagnetic energy as a basis for manifestaition in many ways, through embedding information to dictaphones to the theory of interaction of E.m.f in conjunction with positive ions with the production of plasma. The interaction of objects is also intersting + aginst + and - against - can as we know produce repulsion, which is theoreticaly a means to producing poltergeist activity.. the list goes on. It has been documented that buildings which are well known to be haunted produce a higher electric bill than those around them. So electricity appears to play some part in the equation. I do agree that it is important to remove as much E.M.F as possible in order to control the variables so as to document the situation closer.
But it also has to be mentioned that theoretical E.M.F interaction and manipulation is only part of the process of investigation as you will know. EVP is one thing, A.V.P is another. The audable documented sound of a voice or sound anomaly which is produced through vibration. This would be an actual interaction atomicaly and classed as a manifestation. Then I.R/red light and U.V video footage of apparant light anomalous activity caught withing the light spectrum, and where there is light there is heat. Then there is personal time line documentation etc all of which builds up a bigger picture of an investigation. I realise that people can be effected by high EMF levels as high levels can interfere with brain frequencies, but if a person experiences anomalous personal activity at below a background E.M.F level of .6mg and an E.V.P is documented at that time, with I.R video documentation it gives us a better picture of a situation. I use this as an example to say yes you are right in your observations, but a well run investigation would have many pieces of documentation equipment in place in order to cover as many bases as possible. We use Temprature, Humidity, Ion count, EMF (tri-field) meters (taking magnetic north into account), Geiger counter, IR and full spec cameras to monitors which are outside the venue (plasibo effect), audio H1/H2 dictaphones (24 wav format), photographic digital/film based, Parabolic audio equipment, laser grids, the list goes on. This is to ensure we can track as many frequency fluctuations as possible. Thankyou for your reply.
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KiloCharlie



Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 47

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem as I see it is in removing potential Electromagnetic Field causes that could reasonably induce audio upon another electronic appliance. Electric cables are a good source for a probable cause & local transmitters are another good source.
The wavelength of a magnetic field is important information, as it tells us a lot, for example how it travels. At microwaves rain & fog shuts down the path, whilst at the other end of the spectrum, the Very long Waves can be passed through water & at Ultra long waves even transmitted through soil, but the wave lengths make them difficult to work with.
There are currently experiments taking place in the 2 to 4 GHz spectrum with through wall/concrete radar. These experiments have produced images of people through 8 inch walls from 20 feet away. Also VLF/ULF has been known to be used for communications between underground military bunkers & ULF is a spectrum very little above those audible to our ears, in fact some radio amateurs use car stereo audio amplifiers for earth mode, with ranges of up to 10km being possible using that & two earth stakes to transmit through soil & underground cables help this mode.
Edited to add. Knowing EMF exists really tells us very little.
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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe ULF has also been used in the production of frequency weapons. But coming back to the point in hand (and what you have said is true) it is important to be aware of the presance of emf polution, but also to understand its position within the production of theoretical manifestation. To observe, document and analyse. The variables keep the job interesting, a bit like juggling water lol.The paranormal investigation is after all about observing the something which manifests from the something, anything can theoreticaly be included within the equation and electrical energy and emf as a by product is also simply part of the system. To remove it could be likened to making bread without water, it's all in the mix.
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KiloCharlie



Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 47

PostPosted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 3:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But the problem is Iain, can someone who does not understand even the basics of what a electromagnetic field is & what a EMF meter does ever be taken seriously when they talk about EMF's? And if they are making statements about EVP's or EMF's when they do not know what they are talking about, what good does that do anyone? Also unless someone can prove that they have even a basic understanding of EMC & show that they have taken reasonable precautions against the noises heard being man made. How can that ever advance any argument for this being anything but a bunch of believers attempting to support the unsupportable, by the use of equipment that is meaningless in their hands.
Also do those who use such equipment & make claims that are so easily questioned & disproved as probably being of man made origin not make life harder for those who question & attempt to learn?
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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have a point.
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KiloCharlie



Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 47

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An elctromagnetic field is a force of nature, one of 3 or 4...I forget which. And without going into too much science, it. Without some form of definition is meaningless. So someone using an EMF meter that gives no calibrated reference to both field strength or frequency is not making a valid observation, just a useless observation.
The frequencies we come across every day starts at Sound at 20hz to around 2khz, although it is normally said to be 30hz to 3khz as it's a figure that fits with the other 3's in the spectrum. We then go through Ultra Low Frequency. Very Low Frequency. Low Frequency (or Long wave.) Medium Frequency (or Wave.) High Frequency (or Short Wave.) Very High Frequency, Ultra High Frequency & then into the Microwaves & Light Waves...All are EMF's & their wave length varies from many miles long to millimeters long. Can EVP's take advantage of a wave form of any length? An EMF meter will certainly not answer that.
Now what about the EMF strength. We could ask does the meter use as mono axis probe (antenna in effect) which needs 3 different measurement points, we could mention Isotropic deviation, or say does it use a tri axle probe & point out this needs 3 time specific measurement to be taken. We could point out that an Active probe could be connected to a spectrum analyser. But at the end of the day the one question that cannot be asked is...What details do you collect on Field Strengths are able to be effected, because unless it's a properly calibrated instrument. Any measurement is pointless.
I have spent long periods in EMF's ranging from a few KHz to couple of GHz & in close proximity to antennas producing anything from a few milliwatts to many Kilowatts & can tell you for a fact, it pays to know what you are dealing with. As standing a few feet from a MW antenna loaded with 10KW is fine, but the same cannot be said of just a few watts at a couple GHz.
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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you say is cool and has a baring upon the situation as far as EMF and electrical energy and wave function is concerned.But we have to look again at the picture of apparant manifestation as a whole. Yes it is true to say that to observe energy levels of any kind within an environment can not put the finger upon factual manifestation or interaction. That is fare enough, but to asses one or two frequency area's is not the point in fact. Manifestation of anomalous activity has shown us that when analysed as an over view fluctuates through many frequency area's. Light,heat,Electrical, Electromagnetic and audio embedded activity. The medium of an anomalous energy appears to be constantly fluctuant and cross's many energy systems. This is why when conducting an indepth investigation we use many types of audio/video and sensory tech equipment as we can, so we can follow the passage of interaction. Simply to watch video wouldn't cut it or to listen to audio. Even to conduct investigations with EMF and Microwave equipment, with humidity and temp, none of this gear alone will cut the mustard. We have to have personal experience time lines and a full range of sensory equipment along with audio/video, the list goes on. Only then can we even attempt to guess as to a situation being anomalous. Most of my own theorys delve deep into metaphysics and are based upon personal experience and time in the field experience during apparant anomalous episodes. Along with mass's of study and interest in many varying atributes such as cosmology and theoretical sciences to mediumship and charminism. To understand the small we must take on board the big. I can not say you are right or wrong in your enquiry, but if you are doing anything pro active within the feild you can bet I'll be listening to what you have to say and applying that theoretics to my mental database. Science has a very large part to play in the journey to ward the concepts of the paranormal, but science is only theory and is in turn to be taken on board with an open and equiring mind. I discount nothing and believe nothing as gospel. Emf,Elf,Vhf etc all play there part in the bigger picture, It's a wonderfull subject and I'm sure you will interject a great deal to it, but it is so important to offer advice, but more important to take it. Thankyou for your interaction.
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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just one other point of interest, advanced physics has shown that EMF is the only universal ingredient which is present at all states. That is to say sub atomic etc within the realms of quantum and string theory. I would say that it could be seen to be an important constiuant within the overall picture, simply because someting has no scientific general importance, doesn't make it unimportant. Afterall the electrons within a theoretical atom are only 5% of the mass weight, the proton and the neutron having almost the same equal weight. But that doesn't mean the electrons are un important. Without the electrons or the correct amount of electrons in the mix the atomic structure is effected. Everything has its place and electromagnetic energy at whatever level may well have a baring upon the production of a manifestation through what ever means of utilisation. Just a thought.
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miketaylor



Joined: 05 Feb 2012
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only person I need to impress is my wife and she is the one doing most of the equipment orders. If science held all the answers of the universe we would not be having this discusion.

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Iain Lawrence



Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 419

PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Indeed.
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